A few questions about OCD

[brilliant!MacLeod]

Hi there,has anybody any experience of OCD(obsessive compulsion disorder)?

My daughter developed it lately and it´s neither common in Germany to know about it nor-if you do- to admit such a thing is existing ,nor even to talk about it! Psyco therapie still is not a real option here and you surly would never talk about it. Same about aknowledging mental disorders.

But I´m lucky to have a good friend living nearby who is American and a physiotherapist with the army so I found out about my daughters problems and the reasons for it finally. We got a very good book about it and my daughter who is REALLY suffering is working with me at the problem but it´s still difficult if there is no one around exept one person to ask.
I hope this is the right place to ask for help or information.
My daughter is saving junk that she has touched,hair from the whole family because she can´t stand being separated from it(by no we are after some discussions able to throw these into the garden so that they rot and stay with us) and she is having a REAL bad time if she can´t save things she touched and I can see her in real mental pain if she doesen´t get her way.Thanks to my friend she can understand what´s happening to her but we just started to work on it and it will take a long time to get an improvement.
BTW,I think it´s in hubby´s family,too(shsh,don´t talk about that!),he has an obsession cleaning the windows at least twice a day and using the vacuum cleaner all the time,his Mum is saving everything in case she might need it again and so could save resources(Wich never happens,the whole house is filled with stuff) -but,as expected,everything has to come from my family,the precious academics being professors and doctors and being soooo intelligent and superiour to others could not have ANYTHING even remotely resembling a MENTAL(brr,how nasty!) problem!!!
Not that it is of any importance,it´s nobodys fault,but in Germany being mentally disordered always HAS to be somebodys fault....
Sorry,I stop rambling now but I really could use some help for my little girl!
Thanks for your patience!!!

[pukkie]

Hello Alexandra
I search a littlebit for you

Here in Maastricht is a special team in Academi Hospital for OCD
When i read about it ,i see that it is very important to find out is it OCD ore maby something else .

Here is a website about it
You can make a test ,to find out several things .

I did not find much in German language ,but do you need help with something i hear it from you

http://www.ocdvriendenkring.org/

[Coolwater]

I'm sorry about your daughter's situation, Alexandra. OCD is a recognized medical condition here in the US. It is a form of anxiety disorder, in which people try to control their anxiety by engaging in actions that will magically keep them safe. We even have a humorous TV show about a severely impaired OCD detective. It's called Monk, and while Monk's therapist isn't doing a good job, the show has the advantage of making people sympathetic to people with the disease, and aware that OCD people can be intelligent people who truly suffer from their compulsions. http://www.usanetwork.com/series/monk/


People with OCD here can go to see psychiatrists and psychologists for help.
Here are good overviews of the condition. The first is from a well-respected medical site:
http://www.aafp.org/afp/980401ap/eddy.html

This second site says that there are no good medications for OCD (not entirely true), but it describes the behavioral treatment and cognitive treatment pretty well.

http://www.helpguide.org/mental/obsessive_compulsive_disorder_ocd.htm

The drugs available for OCD are not all antidepressants, but they all do have some serious side effects, take several weeks to have a noticeable effect, and they do NOT clear up all the symptoms. The good part about the drugs is that for many people, taking a pill is easy and not frightening, so they are willing to try it. After they have been on the drugs for a while, they usually want to get off because they don't like that they are getting fat, and have no sex drive.

Behavioral therapy is actually more effective, especially when combined with cognitive therapy, and therapy can relieve 90% of the symptoms or more. The problem with behavioral therapy is that it is temporarily scary and uncomfortable because it means being prevented from engaging in the compulsive behavior. It works quite well, but I would not recommend allowing a therapist who has not had specialized training to treat your daughter. If it is done badly, the symptoms can become worse, so do be sure to have her treated by an OCD specialist.

It would not surprise me if you find a therapist who gives your daughter anti-anxiety medication for a little while, and then adds behavioral therapy, eventually weaning her off the medication. Treatment that mixes drugs and therapy is usually more effective for emotional problems than either drug treatment or therapy alone, and while I have not heard of that being done for OCD, it does make sense.

The fact that your husband's family is embarrassed by their OCD is going to be a problem for you, I think. Treatment is best if the entire family helps follow the threapist's directives. If you can afford to take your daughter out of town for a few weeks for treatment without the extended family knowing, that might be best. Once her symptoms are better, then perhaps you can confess, and they, too, may want to be treated.

I am a research psychologist who generally deals with normal human behavior, but if I can be of help with the English sites, please let me know. I'll be happy to help where I can.

[brilliant!MacLeod]

Thank you so much,Astrid and Cool,I will surely come back to you if I need further help. My husband´s family is 300 miles away so they won´t find out if I don´t tell them. Hubby is not on good terms with them so that is no problem.
But what is a major problem is hubby himself,not recognizing the seriousness of the disorder and instead yelling at her ,telling her he doesen´t like her any longer(how helpful and sensitive!) ,to just pull herself together and not to make such a fuss.He even threatened her not to take her to Italy for vacation!!!!
And he calls himself a doctor!!!
We started with that book of my friend that is explaining to her what is happening with her and that will try to give her some tools to make her feel better in the end.So far she is open to it and I´ll try as long as possible.
I think it will be difficult to find an appropriate therapist,ocd is not so aknowledged around here. The only disorder that is "common" is when you have the compulsion to wash yourself all the time.
Thanks for the links,I will go to all of them.

BTW,Cool,what is a research psycologist?

I´ll let you know what is going to happen(maybe I might smack hubby to get some sense into his mind...)

[Beatrice]

Hi Alexandra!
For my opinon and direct interest all MEN and HUBBY in general never recognize his psicologic's problems. So, I can understand your hubby. -Besides he is Italian, indeed???-
I am having a hard time with my hubby because one year ago his mother died. He don't have OCD, but serious many little psycologic's problems whose cames from his childwood and the cause of his discomfort was his mum and her problematic manners. It was very difficult explain to him the cause of this problems, problems who he won't recognize. Now his remember about the past time with his parents and he has the sensation to lost his "roots". Roots who her mum never "take" to him. He is in a dark period, but I and my mum are with him and now he become to understand.
I hope to take my part for a little help and I hope too explain quite clear in English!:o
Love,
Bea.

[brilliant!MacLeod]

Thanks,Bea!
Hubby is not Italian but he lived in Firenze and Roma for a certain time,so maybe he adopted some "italian manners"?( no offense intended! I love Italy,we are headed for Tuscany this summer))
He has a lot of problems with his parents as well and is getting a kind of depression whenever he has more than short contact with them or learns too many things about their everyday life(wich is VERY complicated as were the family relationships in this family in general). So I can clearly see and understand what you are going through!
I hope your husband will recover soon!!!!

Love,

[Sam]

:(Alex I am so sorry to hear that our sweet Kira is not doing well. I was under the impression she was doing better. Here is a link with some very good info.
http://www.helpguide.org/mental/obsessive_compulsive_disorder_ocd.htm

You know my Hubby has a bad case of OCD so you can ask me ANYTHING at all about it. With kids it is very difficult to find a med that is safe enough but there are some out there. Ty has it and the only drug they found to work for him was Abilify. It is an anti anxiety drug. If you use the drugs to help....DO NOT USE AN ANTIDEPRESSANT!! They have been linked with a side effect that can cause suicidal tendencies in children. Please only use a VERY mild anti anxiety drug.
It would help a GREAT deal if hubby was on board with her treatment because he is a doctor. Men find it almost impossible to accept and deal with such situations. To you hubby it is the same as if saying our daughter is flawed and it is your fault because you are flawed. He can't accept that. His male ego won't allow it! For centuries men have been brought up to believe they HAVE to be infallible. They think these are signs that they are weak and are in some ways less than a man. If he ever does accept it he will probably become so guilt ridden that he won't be much help to you. It has to do with his own need to control every aspect of himself and his life. Which is in itself part of OCD.
Instead it is easier for him to blame you and your family. I know all this first hand! I am in NO WAY a doctor. But God knows I've spent enough time with them while trying to learn ways to deal with it.

[Sam]

Kira's might have been there all along but you never noticed because it was in a milder form. The death of her Grandfather along with the pressure of school added to the hormonal changes going on with her body was probably the trigger for it. Hubby has always had it but his became EXTREME when he lost his best friend in an auto accident (which could have been a suicide given the fact that he drove by the spot he was killed in a week before and told my husband and son that was the place he was going to die at. Hubby blames himself for not seeing the signs or knowing for sure.) Then a few months later he lost his mother which was followed a few months later by the death of my mother and my middle brother who was the closest thing to a brother he ever had. After that he shut himself down from normal life and from most of the people who love him. He tries to do the same with me and the kids but we won't let him. That makes him feel out of control and angry a lot of the time.
Collecting is a way of gaining some sort of control they feel they have lost in their lives. It isn't just the collecting that is important in helping her though.
The items she collects and why she chose that specific item is significant in helping her. Patience and understanding is going to help her a great deal. Ask her to explain why she chose each object and what it means to her.
BTW I fully agree with Coolwater's assessment! And I think it helps knowing there are others out there who understand what it's like.
I have a lot of people who ask me why I don't just divorce my hubby because he is so impossible at times. Well I take my marriage vows very serious and because we have spent most of our lives together...I know where his fears come from and I understand how they could easily overwhelm his mind. I know that it is part of a disease and he doesn't choose to have it any more than I chose to have MS or liver disease. And as much as we would like to give up on each other ...we are both too stupid and stubborn to do so.

[Beatrice]

Thank you Alexandra!
Yes, I am agree with you, and surely the parent's influence & family "do" a big part in our mind and soul.....
But in particular Italian Men and Sicily Men -with no offence- very often are "mum's dependent" and when a boy became a man "borns" many problems...
I hope you and your daughter can resolve the problem soon!
Love,
Bea.

[brilliant!MacLeod]

Hi Sam,now I saw your post-thank you!
You are right about men and their way of dealing with things.
But our special problem is that hubby can´t help Kira because he is too much involved.If she was just a patient,he could help he with professional distance.
So I have to find another way.

I tried all the links you all gave to me and they were all very helpful,Thank you again!!!!!

I also found some stuff in German but it´s not really helpful.
They are all so astonished that this kind of disorder is existing more often than they thought and mostly suggest only pills .Not my first choice.

As long as my daugter is cooperative,wich she still is to a certain degree,I´m hopeful we´ll succeed.
Looking back now I see that the problem has always been there,only in a milder version,so we didn´t actually realize it. I think it´s part of her personality and as long as we can reduce it to an acceptable level she´ll be fine in the end.
So,one step at a time.

[EvanStar4506]

Hi Alexandra, I can only suggest that you don't give up.
I had a third cousin that suffered from OCD maybe caused by stress. I think he was prescribed medication but he really need behavioral modification therapy.
I lost touch with that side of the family ever since my second cousin (his mother died).

[Sam]

Alex I have a thought that might help Kira.
She is collecting items that she associates with the people who mean the most to her...Right?
I'm thinking that if she has a charm bracelet or necklace...then each person could give her a charm for it (or she could choose the charms herself). If the charms hold a special significance of her relationship with those people then she will she carries them with her wherever she goes. During times of stress she could train herself to hold the charms so that she gets the comfort she needs.
Another thing is that Kira is Very artistic. She especially has a gift at crafting and baking so when she feels stressed try letting her take a break to either bake something or make something. That might help.
Stress increases the blood pressure and quickly burns up vitamins especially Vitamin B. Increasing the amount of juices such as types of grapefruit, orange, tangerine, beet or pommegranite to her diet will also help as well as adding extra vitamin B. Most of these juices contain nitrate which when mixed with saliva become healthy nitrites which lower the blood pressure.
Keeping her blood pressure lower at times of stress will lessen her need for the collecting behavior.
Give her a HUGE HUG for me!;)

[brilliant!MacLeod]

That´s a great idea!!!!!!
I´ll try that ,thank you so much!!!:)

[Coolwater]

Any possibility of seeing a therapist while you are in Italy?

[brilliant!MacLeod]

I guess not,but I´ll take our workbook with us so we can go on with our training.